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(08-22-2014, 12:31 AM)ricardo shillyshally Wrote: [ -> ]I think that would have been an interesting idea; the guys meet 'geeky' women whom they only see as friends(whole characters, even with surnames!), share interests, maybe Sheldon meets a woman at model train shop, more interactions. Usually women are only introduced as sexual objects, and then disappear, or are 'love interests', that we get stuck with them! Just have to keep stud Leonard, occupied! That line works every time!!!

Aww, I liked your other name better, Pilot Fish! Although, this one is nothing if not unique!

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I do not believe that H. is a Neil Diamond fan. I just don't. I imagine he would like some '70s "light rock" type of stuff like ELO, etc...

I like "ricardo shillyshally" very much Mister

Pilot Fish you utter scoundrel, Ricardo Shillyshally is from Season 6! It's the bloody Phantom Menace...Although aesthetically it's a good name, but still!



(amazing the shit you find on the internet...)

I like to think the name is 'a poorly contructed figment of Sheldon's imagination'!

Maybe this belongs in the "wishful thinking" thread, but the storyline I wanted for Howard would be to watch him become more independent. Everyone keeps blathering about "growth" and "maturity", but one of the major signs of maturity is being independent, to whatever degree you are able. Nobody will convince me that going straight from living with his mother to living with Bernadette is "growth." He's never had his own apartment, poor guy.

If Howard's mother threw him out, or moved away or something, he'd have to fend for himself and make his own way. You could get some really cute and meaningful storylines out of that. Maybe he and Raj could be roomies for a while, and that would be awesome.

IMO they have actually made Howard *more* selfish, childish, and lazy just to make B. look better by comparison and set up some contrived conflicts. We know he is smart and resourceful. I simply don't believe that he'd be laying in the gutter if his mother and Bernadette weren't around. Presumably he left home to go to M.I.T and he did okay. I simply don't believe he's so irresponsible and lazy that he has to be supervised by a woman at all times. That pisses me off; he's not that feckless and useless. He can go to space but he can't learn how to take care of himself? That's b.s.

Howard breaking away from his mother, even if it was only temporary, would've been a great storyline, it wouldn't have to be saccharine and weepy and melodramatic, and it would be an example of *real* "character development." You don't have to change a character's personality, you just put them in different situations and see how they react.

Really, I think the Canon Brigade has no idea what phrases like "growth" or "character development" actually mean. Those are just euphemisms for anything that brings them more Rom-com stuff.

I would be one hundred percent okay if *nothing* about this show had changed from its early-seasons state, but if we must have changes, let's see the characters spread their wings and cut loose a little and be free. And that storyline could be meaningful in a subtle way, but also cute and FUNNY.

Character development is not a synonym for weddings and babies and ships, and more ships. Somebody's forgotten that friendship is also a ship, and the most important relationship is how one feels about oneself...

I would've loved to watch Howard realize that he can be okay without his mother, (or her replacement) even if this was done in very, very small ways. *Especially* if this was done in very small ways and with a light touch. What they've done instead just wrecks me.

Howard - even before the show confirmed it, I thought, his father left them when he was young, and he's had to be the man of the house ever since. There's a weird interdependent thing going on there, he and his mother complain and fight, but they'd be lost without the other one. You know that she boasts about her clever son, doing well at the university. He did leave home to go to MIT, but I think he moved back deliberately to take care of his mother, part filial obligation but part love, too. He's always struck me as the most grown up of the guys in certain ways, because for sure, he's the one that deals with bills and house repairs and actual real life situations. It's entirely possible that he hasn't got a doctorate because finances don't allow for it.

The H/B moved far too quickly, and turning B into a cheap copy of a cheap stereotype did everyone a disservice.

"He's always struck me as the most grown up of the guys in certain ways, because for sure, he's the one that deals with bills and house repairs and actual real life situations. It's entirely possible that he hasn't got a doctorate because finances don't allow for it."

Yes, and he probably has student loan payments to make, too. That's why it makes me angry when recent seasons try to portray him as irresponsible and helpless. I'm sure he's been spoiled by his mother in some ways, but he's not Homer Simpson-level useless, which is kind of what we're getting now. They want him to be the stereotypical dumb sitcom husband, and that's not what he's supposed to be, at all. He's plucky and smart. What we're seeing now is such an inversion of what he's really like, resilient and practical.

The more I think about it, the more it bothers me: they make Howard irresponsible and helpless just so that he and B. will have something to argue about. There was always a hint of that, with him, but it's gotten more extreme.

The writers make it seem like he'd be laying on the floor in a pile of Cheetos if she wasn't there to nag him and manipulate him into doing things. Like I said, that's such an inversion of what he's supposed to be, which is energetic and arguably the most practical of the four guys. That is the furthest thing from the bright and dynamic character that he is/was. Yes, he's a mama's boy and he's been spoiled/sheltered, but he's not passive like that. I'm sure there'd be a learning curve if H. had to live on his own for the first time, but he could do it. He'd be okay. He's not Homer Simpson. That ep. about "B. hid H's gaming console in the dryer" is the most boring, inane sh*t imaginable. The idea that he can't manage money, also rings false. Having ditched the flirtatious and colorful parts of his personality, the writers have nothing left but his weaker qualities, so now they're over-emphasizing that.

These are just stock characters from Sitcom 101, now. We've gone from "Smart is the new sexy" to "Men are dumb, women are bitchy." These are the absolute oldest cliches in the book, literally as old as television itself. It's like they're pulling sitcom tropes out of a hat.

I wouldn't be surprised if this show's audience is now skewing older, as well as skewing more female. I can't picture teens or college-aged viewers being enraptured with mother-in-law jokes and all this *ancient*, Rodney Dangerfield, "take my wife, please.." type of stuff.

Then again, maybe the viewership is too young to know or remember how old these jokes and cliches are.

This brings me to a larger issue: turning the characters against each other instead of giving them something to *do*, is extremely lazy writing. There's always been arguing and mild conflict on this show, but most of the time it was comical enough to not be tiresome, like when Sheldon and Leonard clashed in "The Cooper-Hofstadter Polarization."

Conflict for its own sake, though, is not entertaining. Conflict for its own sake is not a plot. "Character A and Character B are arguing" is not a plot. It's just storm and fury, signifying nothing. There's nothing very compelling about drama for the sake of drama.

I would rather see the characters confront some type of problem or challenge that is external to themselves, not fight amongst themselves. That's the problem with a show that is character-driven, not plot-driven: it starts cannibalizing itself.

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Here is a cute old-school pic to act as a refreshing palate-cleanser after my angry rant:

Howard getting "funky" and the guys doing "science"

The unveiling