Sex and Sheldon

[devilbk]

I don't think the Shamies understand that Amy is a figure of ridicule. For that matter, I'm not sure that Bialek understands that either.

As for what would theoretically bring Shenny together, I have to think it would be a serious crisis of some kind where Leonard and Amy are either not available or caused the crisis in the first place. However that is constructed I think Sheldon and Penny would need to be isolated from the rest of the group to grow closer.

[Tuesday Pajamas]

Great posts going on in this thread. I don't agree with everything said but that's the beauty of this place. We can say what we think.

Dev - yes, they made Amy a figure of ridicule for quite a long time. Really took it quite far. Then suddenly they turned it all around. She's now a friggin' protagonist. These writers know they can do anything. Amy may have started as a figure of ridicule but now people love her. It's quite staggering how much the character has changed. They very cleverly manipulated the audience. At first people were like YIKES she's creepy then they had Sheldon be mean to her for a season and everyone went AWWWW and now look. Fascinating U-turn. Even to the point of having Sheldon have sex with her. Something I admit, I didn't thought people would ever accept. Of course the result is a not that good but still they seem to be having fun just twisted everything to their will.

[FlyingMonkey]

Two things here from me-

One I've said before, Sheldon lacks appropriate socialisation at a peer level.  He was unable to connect with kids, and was some kind of sideshow for adults.  His template for (marital) relationships was his parents, which, even before the stereotyping and retconning, sounded difficult.  Then, his source for social cues in later life consisted of a lech, a mute and a desperate scraping of Oedipal wreckage, all of whom seem to regard getting sex as a life goal.  No wonder he backed away from the idea of relationships, all the ones he has been exposed to are dysfunctional and unhealthy.

Two, Amy Farrah Fowler is meant to be a disgusting figure of fun.  She's a nasty stereotype anyway, the plain brain desperate for sex.  She could have been sympathetic, rather than just pathetic, but she lacks any charm at all.  Licking people's belongings is not cute.  Witholding medication to get your own way is not cute.  Torturing things in a lab whilst making sexual innuendos is not cute.  I could go on, but...  The character is deliberately dressed to be unappealing. That is the whole 'joke'.  It's offensive, misogynistic, anti-intellectual, and made significantly worse by the inner nature of the character.  Nobody is meant to find her attractive.

The combination means that the punchline of this entire clusterfuck is, essentially, 'smart won't get you laid, so however brilliant your career or achievements, it means nothing, haha' - and validating some horrendous behaviours in the process.  Sheldon has been encouraged, bullied, in fact, by everyone around him to engage in ways he finds confusing, uncomfortable and distasteful.  No wonder he's regressed to licking toys and can't find his way out of buildings.  

As a personal note, I think he is actually a perfectly normal male who lacks experience or comprehension of certain social situations.  He's attracted to Penny, but the peer group have wrecked his self-perception and confidence, he's been told not to trust his instincts.  He's not attracted to Amy, who is deeply unappealing, but everyone is telling him to give in. He's one lone individual, who has had his unique self damaged and battered until he's broken.  Originally, he had confidence in his originality, but that's been taken away from him.  All he has now is drab, stunted, boring and disgusting.

Standing ovation!!!  

[Idle Miscreant]

Drifting past to fling my tuppence at the topic...

Completely ignoring the gradual stripping of every single original Sheldonic trait (routines, germ phobia, lack of romantic or sexual interest, GENIUS, self-sufficiency, multi-talents such as languages, theremin, throat singing etc, haughtiness, dignity, detachment...) in favour of this new bland bumbling toddler boyfriend Sheldon, I'll just note;

For people who don't like being touched, it does not get easier or more pleasant magically. It certainly doesn't get more desirable, and sex under those circumstances is utterly preposterous. Ergo, either they've whisked away yet another Sheldonic trait, or sex was indeed a duty carried out by this new Sheldon in an effort to keep another constant in his life. Either option is unpleasant.

The only plausible way for Sheldon to have sex, in my opinion, whilst keeping in character, would be with somebody he was passionate about, indeed borderline obsessed with, thus this passion overules both the logical, rational objection and the inherent, instinctive repulsion.
When he was obsessed with finding the Toad of Truth he flung himself into a communal ballpit, an act no self-respecting germaphobe would even contemplate.

The problem is he's never, in 5 years, been shown to be at ALL passionate about the girlfriend they've given him. He never initiates anything, he spent several years essentially ignoring her, and he's always on a completely different planet when it comes to innuendo. What Amy talks about, or thinks is going on, or thinks Sheldon thinks is going on, is NEVER what Sheldon is thinking. As PJ said, the "joke" of their relationship is mixed signals. Sexually frustrated Amy, oblivious Sheldon. Repeat. Ad nauseam. So much nauseam.

Sheldon is (or was) characterized by passion above all things. He doesn't half-arse anything. Why would this not extend to love as well? I do most certainly think the character as he is portrayed currently (from what little I've seen) loves Amy, indeed. But IN love? Not in the slightest.
And unfortunately for me (and others), Sheldon IN love, consumed by an obsession, is the only manner I wish to see the character engage in any sort of sexuality, not as some sort of tepid obligation.
But that boat has sailed as regards Amy. The relationship has always been tepid, similar to Penny's comment about her and Leonard being "a new boring type of love". Which might be realistic, but I don't care to watch it.  

Penny I could have seen Sheldon engage sexually with, principally because their early interactions were VERY passionate. They infuriated each other, and wound each other up. They have always had a very vivid relationship. I would have personally still preferred them to remain friends, but in another version of the show, certainly that relationship could have become sexual very easily.  

It's still there, that old verve between them, and it wouldn't take much to have Sheldon and Penny finally realise this. As PJ said, Penny would have to see Sheldon in a new light (the suit-buying in Pants Alternative is a classic example of this trope), and Sheldon...well Sheldon was prepared to fall in love with her LAST season, as part of an experiment. He also mentioned her as a dating option when he was single a few months ago. So sister my arse. He already tells her things he tells bugger all anybody else. So a handful more "She's remarkable" and "We're dreamers" moments and the damn thing writes itself.

But the writers don't want to, and that's grand. We've known that from the beginning. Shipping has fuckall to do with what happens on any given show. It's about CHARACTERS. Which ones you think complement each other, or whose interactions you find the most intriguing. If your interests are different from the writers', then you have to ship "off-world" so to speak. But it certainly doesn't invalidate that pairing. It just makes it hypothetical.
In the case of TBBT, this lack of intention is the only thing stopping Sheldon and Penny from being a viable (and incredibly bloody interesting) relationship. The characters themselves are eminently suitable.

Personally I stopped watching the show last season. Not because I "finally accepted that Shenny wasn't going to happen" (as we've seen a few bizarre comments about), because as I keep banging on about, I prefer Sheldon to remain SINGLE. Rather, I stopped watching because I don't like the way Parsons is being made to play Sheldon these past few years. I don't find the character either funny or interesting. Certainly not the bloody hero worship I still have for Sheldon Seasons 1-4. I put up with bumbling, foolish, boyfriend-Sheldon because he occasionally still had scenes with Penny, and in those moments he seemed to revert back to the old quick-witted, smug, rather alien Sheldon that drew me to the show in the first place.

But if HE'S gone AND there are no more Penny/Sheldon scenes to conjure Vintage Sheldon up, then to hell in a handbasket with it.

[Toad]

And at the end of this long ignominious day, what was it all for? What's the takeaway here?

That if you wait, and wait, and wait and wait, and drop some subtle hints and some not-so-subtle hints and then all but scream that you want sex, and debase yourself, and bribe and connive and conspire, and roll your eyes and disparage and screech I'M THE BEST GIRLFRIEND YOU'LL EVER HAVE, and whine and pine and preen, and stomp away in a stony-faced huff, and stay away long enough, just long enough, until something  HALLELUJAH!  turns over in your manchild boyfriend, and he seeks you out and murmurs dubious lovewords, and so now you're his heartworm, and he offers up his genitals on your birthday...

on your birthday...

only on your birthday...

and afterwards the veil drops again, and he doesn't get it, and you ain't getting it, and so you wait, and wait and wait...?


That's like the longest ever setup (and carnage) for a punchline. A bazinga. Sheldon finally FINALLY has sex. Five episodes later it's back to no business as usual. 

[HomoNovus]

Hi I'm new! I can't stand what they're doing and already did to SHeldon but also Penny and Wolowitz. Penny turned into a 40 years old stepmom and poor Wolowitz of course is trapped in the role of the "sweet" husband. I can't stand Amy anymore, if we can still call her Amy, in the current season I just see Mayim Bialik in drag. When she first arrived in Season 4 at least she made some kind of sense as a potential girlfriend for Sheldon (even though the actress was already boring in her Jim Parsons' impersonation). When they decided to change her character and she became super horny I really couldn't see why Sheldon stayed in that relationship. Plus she's sneaky, preachy and needy all the time (even more than Leonard if it's possible). She dresses like a grandma and she looks old next to Jim. She has ruined the greatness of Sheldon's character. He has become boring and uninspired probably just being in her proximity.

[SpaceAnJL]

Hello! And welcome to a like-minded soul. I entirely agree with you*, and have said as much, only with more profanity.

*Except for the bit about the Oncoming Abomination making sense. That had "Hell no" written all over it from the start.

[HomoNovus]

Hello! And welcome to a like-minded soul. I entirely agree with you*, and have said as much, only with more profanity.

*Except for the bit about the Oncoming Abomination making sense. That had "Hell no" written all over it from the start.

Thanks!! I understand

[HomoNovus]

I would honestly be happier, if we didn't have Shamy, but just kinda asexual Sheldon, and Lenny... I would prefer that. because we'd still have the shenny as friends interactions. he wouldn't be a "threat" to anyone and so they could still interact. we would still have these awesome moments between them, her going to him about her stupid marriage, him encouraging her to keep going after her dream... etc. them being this extremely close and wonderful friendship that is honestly kinda rare on tv these days. i kiss that more then anything. I would take Shenny Friendship over anything else, because it is the most real and honest of the the whole show.

Same and also because the writers clearly don't know how to write romance. Just take a look at the couples on the show.

[Tuesday Pajamas]

Hi I'm new!  I can't stand what they're doing and already did to SHeldon but also Penny and Wolowitz. Penny turned into a 40 years old stepmom and poor Wolowitz of course is  trapped in the role of the "sweet" husband. I  can't stand Amy anymore, if we can still call her Amy, in the current season I just see Mayim Bialik in drag. When she first arrived in Season 4 at least she made some kind of sense as a potential girlfriend for Sheldon (even though the actress was already boring in her Jim Parsons' impersonation). When they decided to change her character and she became super horny I really couldn't see why Sheldon stayed in that relationship. Plus she's sneaky, preachy and needy all the time (even more than Leonard if it's possible). She dresses like a grandma and she looks old next to Jim. She has ruined the greatness of Sheldon's character. He has become boring and uninspired probably just being in her proximity.

First of all, welcome to the boards HomoNovus. I agree, I think Amy has destroyed the greatness of Sheldon. They have diminished him and he's so washed out alongside her. He's all bland and lost a lot of that sensual charm the character once had in bucketloads.