What kind of HQer are you?

[ricardo shillyshally]

I know, this Major character is a whole different being to the Count! Yes I was just a naive forum child seven months ago. Please not the bagpipes! I used to share a house with a guy who busked with them. He wasn't Scottish, but wore a kilt, and made a very small fortune.

[Berliner]

Definitely a Nostalgic, by all means. Includes Vintage Sheldon and all the fun stuff from the early seasons. I'm not opposed to Shenny, on the contrary, I think if Sheldon decided to ever have a real relationship with somebody, it should have been Penny.

[Moonbase]

I'm a Sheldon purist and it's my belief that he was created asexual or some form of. Asexual people can still find others attractive as Sheldon noticed Penny's good looks but they have little interest in sexual intercourse with another person even though some do attempt it.

But Jim Parsons was such a big draw for female viewers....and some guys of course... and the actors own preference for change meant the writers chose to alter his fundamental nature. To me, this presents itself in a distortion of his personality, he is no longer the dead pan self-contained loner he once was. A great loss in my opinion.

The problem is not that Sheldon shouldn't have someone, if they want to make him sexually active then so be it but JP has no discernible chemistry with the person they picked to take him through this transformation. This is only my opinion of course.

[ricardo shillyshally]

It seems to me they brought in a wide range of different characters/actresses to see which ones worked with our heroes. They're like the Jewish mothers(cliche), that has to match up their sons, with whom they see as correct. I can see H and B working(even though she's catholic, and annoys the hell out of me!). But Amy for Sheldon, are they crazy! She is, as someone has indicated, a succubus vulture. As you say, he's unique and complete in his own right. It isn't a transformation/growth, but a fundamental destruction of his core being that's required to match him to Amy. And the idea that L and P were set from the beginning is just wrong. Since John Cage incorporated the accident that works into art, as part of the whole Zen/death of the author, they should have realised that creativity is an 'open process'. Hopefully future writers will learn from this!

[Wisp]

I'm a Sheldon purist and it's my belief that he was created asexual or some form of. Asexual people can still find others attractive as Sheldon noticed Penny's good looks but they have little interest in sexual intercourse with another person even though some do attempt it.

But Jim Parsons was such a big draw for female viewers....and some guys of course... and the actors own preference for change meant the writers chose to alter his fundamental nature. To me, this presents itself in a distortion of his personality, he is no longer the dead pan self-contained loner he once was. A great loss in my opinion.

The problem is not that Sheldon shouldn't have someone, if they want to make him sexually active then so be it but JP has no discernible chemistry with the person they picked to take him through this transformation. This is only my opinion of course.

Yes, I think the creators threw a spanner into the works choosing to make THIS BEAUTIFUL CREATURE



... into their "annoying comedy nuisance". Of course, the spanner only exists because of the deeply superficial nature of the show... I think they're still trying to sell off their Sheldon as a dorky, unattractive dick, but he just... isn't. So they thought they had to make him into one. But that doesn't work, because Jim Parsons is playing him, so what we have instead is a confusingly offputting shell of a previously strong character.

That's why I'm a Sheldon Purist. I lament the days when Sheldon was self-content, and did seem capable of a relationship, if treated correctly. Which he wasn't.

[Satnight815]

I guess I would classify myself as a Shenny shipper first, then a Nostalgic, and then a Sheldon Purist. Although I ship Shenny romantically, I should add the caveat that I never actually want to see them together in a relationship… that is until the series finale of this show. Just increasing sexual tension will do nicely for me, thank you. Like many of you, I believe the Sheldon/ Penny storyline is the best one on this show and together, they are quite simply one of my favorite friendship/relationship couples ever to appear on TV. I will always hold on to the hope that TPTB are simply slow walking the other viewers to an epiphany that many here realized 10 minutes into the pilot. The writers always show us how dysfunctional the canon relationships are - that is for anyone willing to see it - and we have written pages here (and on other sites) chronically all the examples. I guess at its root, TPTB believe that this dysfunction is what provides the comic fodder. After all, this show is supposed to be a comedy, right? Whether their strategy succeeds or not is another matter entirely.

As I see it, the writers have always had a choice - a choice to portray the canons either sweetly or romantically but they rarely do this. The interactions of the main couples usually always carry qualifications. Proposals are either given or accepted not when a person is in a position of strength in his/her life, but rather when they are actually in a position of weakness. Shamy kisses are ones born out of manipulation and frustration, offered because Sheldon quite literally has to and not because he wants to (altogether the opposite advice given to him in The Monster Isolation, wouldn't you say?). In the meantime, the writers continue to build a strong friendship between Sheldon and Penny, one based on better principles than those found in the main relationships. I can't remember which member here said it but he/she was wise to point out that writers usually dream of having the kind of chemistry that exists between Jim and Kaley onscreen in their lead actors. To ignore it over the course of the entire series borders on professional negligence if you ask me. My greatest wish is that the writing, acting, directing, and casting haven't been massive failures these last few seasons and that the reason I don't feel any chemistry between the canon couples is that I was never really meant to in the first place. I don’t presume to know how this show will end, and the writers never promised anyone a happy (and by happy, I mean healthy) ending. My good friend gamma reminded me so wisely once that the writers could just as easily have Sheldon pick up his bongos in the finale and walk the earth (roll credits and fade to black). I guess all I am saying is that, with any luck, hopefully these writers are just dragging me kicking and screaming to exactly where I want to go - Shenny endgame.

[Nutz]

I have to say I'm a nostalgic/purist first. The early seasons I can watch over and over again cause they're perfect (with probably 25-30 episodes I could watch everyday). The science, the geek games, heck even the regular Playstation, Wii, and X Box games they played. Sheldon was the most original and thought provoking character to grace the small screen in a long time, and Penny's charm and take no crap attitude, plus the chemistry between the two made this show a breath of fresh air in what was becoming crime procedural hum drum hell.

I also ship Shenny, but I go back and forth on needing it to be romantic. As long as they end up best friends and I mean in the real way, not the "bestie" way, I would probably be happy. (As long as they don't marry Amy and Leonard, then I would rather them be together then put up with that crap). There is a story on Fanfiction called Triple Toddler Troubles by Risknight and she explains the kind of friendship that I want them to have perfectly. Here's the end "Maybe their love wasn't the grand passionate one everyone wishes for, or dreams of, but it was love. The kind that surpassed the physical and even spiritual. It was a love that bound two hearts together".

If you haven't read it yet, you should it's VERY funny in spots.... Oh just read it, you'll see.
https://www.fanfiction.net/s/10136984/1/...r-Troubles

[Idle Miscreant]

Resurrecting this thread again, after an interesting talk with WPP, where it was noted that folk HERE were more upset by Sheldon renouncing Spock, and the show referring to his previous self as "half a man" etc, than they were about him actually having sex with Fowler, or indeed Leonard and Penny getting married.

It does seem, as I've always suspected, the presiding interest here is Sheldon himself, and more importantly, what he REPRESENTS. Ie, the variously entwined concepts of individualism, pride, the quest for truth, faith in oneself, eccentricity, the strength and clarity of the outsider etc.

And thus the recent attack on his character by the show's creators is felt like an attack on the concepts themselves.

I mention this, because a recent trip to another forum (my first in over a month!) made me realise that the canon shippers have very little idea of this focus of ours. Possibly because most of our talk goes on in the Grumblebox, or Time Machine, or Snake Can, or Green Lantern's Buttocks (how the fuck did we name that last one? Mea culpa I suspect...), but possibly also because it's an alien notion to them (at least in regards to TBBT).

I don't see much (or any) talk about what characters represent philosophically on any other TBBT site. The talk seems to revolve entirely around the romantic relationships. Oh, and what delusional bastards the Shennies are.

On that note, I'm interested in what a "Shenny" actually is. I'm technically a "Sheldon Purist who ships Shenny" so what does that make me?

I've only ever seen variations of one definition by canon shippers, who seem to be projecting their own endgame-fixated thought processes here, which is, "Someone who (delusionally, they always add) thinks Sheldon and Penny are secretly in love and will end up together".

Now, I'm not really sure this fits more than a handful of Shenny fans, at least in my observation, so I'd like to classify the subsets of Shenny, if you chaps could help me out here. These are my main groups (based on 2 years vague observation of 3 forums and multiple social media accounts), followed by a percentage. Please correct me.

A) Wouldn't mind if Sheldon & Penny got together - (17%)

People who enjoy S/P scenes beyond all pairings, and thus within the context of the show, "ship" the friendship. Reads Shenny fanfiction, and enjoys the concept in an alternate universe, and loves the innuendo and ambiguous scenes, but would prefer Sheldon remain single on the show. If PRESSED to choose an on-show girlfriend for Sheldon, would choose Penny, absolutely.


B) Would LIKE Sheldon & Penny to get together - (17%)

People who enjoy S/P scenes beyond all pairings, and thus within the context of the show, "ship" the friendship, and if it changed to romance, would thus ship the romance. They have no preference whether it's romance or friendship, they just like the interplay of the characters on every level. Want more scenes above all. A romance would mean more scenes. Will happily read Shenny fanfiction for the same reason.


C) Think Sheldon & Penny SHOULD get together - (60%)

People who think S/P would have made an extraordinary romance, and that the show missed the boat there (whether deliberately and perversely, or just through an artistic cock-up, or through wanting to write for certain actresses *cough*), yet are very aware that TPTB had and has no intention of ever hooking them up, despite plenty of ambiguous scenes and innuendos, and the fact that the early years were essentially structured in a way that almost demanded that Penny and Sheldon, the jousting opposites, get together. If in charge of the show would absolutely put them together immediately.    

D) Think Sheldon & Penny WILL get together - (6%)

People who think S/P has consistently been portrayed as the most honest and intimate relationship on the show (although I think all groups agree on that) and that TPTB are just biding their time to get them together romantically. Either in an organic, traditional way, as the current poisonous relationships dissolve, perhaps even unacrimoniously, and Sheldon and Penny whilst supporting each other, or whilst getting up to hijinks as pals, realise  they're the only ones who have ever been honest with each other, and who challenge and complement the other character, OR as a twist at the end, or something equally spectacular.


NOTE - These are CURRENT self-identifying Shenny fans...I believe during Season 3 that about 90% of Shenny fans were "D"...The natural progression of which, if you're still a fan NOW, would be "C" - That TPTB missed the boat. And the mark. The mark ON the boat, dammit.

So...Thoughts? Group A and B could be lumped together, although I do think there's a distinct brand of Shenny fan (I'm one, for example) who simply doesn't want any sort of romance for Sheldon ON THE SHOW, but bloody loves all the near misses and dodgy scenes with Penny regardless. And I could be WAY off about the percentages of D...

Incidentally, I'm getting all pedantic and niminy-piminy because I'm currently ordering my book characters into little subsets, and this has evidently spread and infected my forum posts...

[FlyingMonkey]

I would put myself in category A but not completely. I don't read FF and I wouldn't necessarily pick Penny for his girlfriend. Above all, I would prefer that Sheldon remain single, a detached, scientific observer of the world around him. His total lack of interest in romantic relationships made him unique and fascinating. He saw those obsessed with romance as lesser beings who were too weak to conquer their urges as he had. He aspired to be Spock. Which is what makes the current developments so jarring. TPTB have simply thrown Vintage Sheldon away.

If PRESSED to chose a girlfriend, I would actually choose someone like Original Amy, who appeared to share his attitudes and interests. The episode with their first date where Penny drove them is one of my favorites. They dispassionately dissected her like a lab specimen and later did the same to Leonard. That was funny. Sadly that version of Amy only lasted a few episodes. Once they rewrote her into a pushy, creepy, gloomy, sex-starved frump she became the WORST possible girlfriend for him, because they used her to change him. And he didn't NEED changing. If the choice is between that Amy and Penny I would obviously choose Penny.

[Trust No One]

While I'd love to be D, I will have to pick C. I have to think any chance of Sheldon and Penny getting together is pretty much gone. I do not see TPTB breaking these Ships apart. They could not even end Raj and Emily no way they will end the Lenny or Shamy.

In terms of girlfriends for Sheldon, I pretty much just wanted Penny, but I would have gladly accepted someone like Martha or even Elizabeth would have been a lot of fun. Someone that could have challenged Penny and made Penny a little jealous even friendship jealously would have been great.