8.06 The Expedition Approximation (Oct 20)

[Tuesday Pajamas]

Sheldon and Raj test whether they could survive a dark-matter research expedition in a salt mine by simulating the conditions in a steam tunnel. Meanwhile, Leonard and Penny seek advice from Wolowitz and Bernadette after they fight about money.









Oh dear lord, get it off me!

[Tuesday Pajamas]

"I have a feeling I'm going to need the bucket sooner than I thought."



Okay, I've probably made enough digs at this one now

[FlyingMonkey]

Can't you just feel the love?

[Nutz]

"I have a feeling I'm going to need the bucket sooner than I thought."



Okay, I've probably made enough digs at this one now

Damn it, if I can just free my arm to throw this bucket of water on her all my problems will be over.

[Idle Miscreant]

Bernadette doesn't bother me particularly, other than as an example of the the concept; One must abandon one's hobbies and passions as one gets older. And that being a "grownup" means you can't have light-sabers mounted on the wall. (Why the fuck not?)
I actually find her rather amusing at times. But this is because she's not shouting at MY favourite character.
If it were Sheldon she was married to, whilst calling him an idiot, and belittling his hobbies, I'd be furious.

Hence my anger at Amy. Who calls Sheldon "annoying", tells him she's the "best girlfriend he's ever going to have" (who SAYS that?), blatantly manipulates him, complains about him, and apparently dislikes everything he finds interesting. One game of counterfactuals and FWF in three years just isn't selling it for me.
He's depicted as having more fun watching CORNSTARCH for fucksake. Also playing with a Time Machine, making Penny Blossoms, inventing boardgames, singing L'Chaim etc etc. Even when he was teaching himself Finnish he looked bloody contented.

I liked that Martha woman, because she seemed genuinely passionate about the same sort of things Sheldon was into, LIKED him, and obviously had no problem with him, for example, wearing Hulk Hands on a date. There are "geek" women you know chaps...

Amy's like a perpetual Nanny State. NO FUN FOR YOU! DON'T SAY THAT! WHY WON'T YOU BEHAVE? The elderly Aunt clothing VS Sheldon's childlike clothing choices disturbs me as well...

So I get where Louise is coming from, with her dislike of Bernadette.
I'd probably have no grave issues with Amy if she wasn't shackled to Sheldon. Doomed to drag him down with her yearned-for ship.

I suspect this is the reason (most) Lenny fans have no issue with her. She's not licking LEONARD'S stapler now is she...Not manipulating Leonard, not telling him he can't do better...

Lenny fans find Amy amusing and don't 'get' why Shenny and Sheldon fans rage against her, but if for whatever inspired reason the writers decided to have Penny work out that Sheldon was the only person who never lied to her, who challenged her, was a fellow dreamer etc and bugger off with him into the sunset, and have Leonard and Amy bond over their shared affectionless childhoods, need for love and approval, and inferiority complexes, THEN I'm sure the Lenny fans wouldn't be quite so amused with Amy.

Seriously, the character was introduced as being completely disinterested in romance, traditional or otherwise, and is now, three years later, almost completely defined by her obsession with being in a normal one, with a home and a family, and a boyfriend who says nice things to her, and is physically affectionate etc. The fact that Sheldon doesn't want any of this is the whole "joke" of the past few seasons, and it's very unpleasant to watch.

I can't imagine it's pleasant for Amy fans to watch either. If she's suddenly going to be defined, bizarrely, by her need for a relationship, then put her in one with RAJ or STUART for godsake.

They'd treat her well, and appreciate her, and Stuart and Amy in particular could get up to some kinky business, and be the "weird couple" of the show, whilst not ruining Sheldon's character, who NEEDS TO REMAIN DETACHED FROM HUMANITY. It's the only way he (and thus the writers) can make illuminating comments upon it.

Until this happens (which it won't) I still can't bear to watch the new seasons. Which is a pity, because there's good writing outside the relationship nonsense, excellent acting from Helberg, Sussman etc and this picture looks vaguely like Vintage Sheldon, and I miss the bastard.

[Louise]

But this is because she's not shouting at MY favourite character.
If it were Sheldon she was married to, whilst calling him an idiot, and belittling his hobbies, I'd be furious.

You see, Gripe, that is how I feel.

Not that Howard is blameless all the time, but people can have disagreements without shouting and name-calling. That is not how a reasonable person or a likeable character behaves, and it's *certainly* not a charming love-story...

This photo and others like it are very upsetting and disturbing to me. Where is that Gif of Penny tossing her laptop away and shuddering? That's exactly how I feel.

Also, I have nothing against Kevin S. getting a storyline, but I find this Stuart-Mrs.W. stuff to be uncomfortable and a very strange choice. Now even *Stuart* is more confident than Howard and has the upper hand???

This version of Howard is just totally powerless and without agency. He's supposed to be plucky and brave

ETA: except for some of his interactions with the other 3 guys, I think SH is no longer playing Howard at all. This is "generic sitcom husband", the kind that can be found on dozens or hundreds of other shows. Or some mildly snarky Chandler Bing knock-off.

The point of Howard is that he's resilient; he gets smacked down but doesn't stay discouraged for long. While it's true that he can sometimes be intimidated by women, he's not *this* much of a pushover. He had no trouble talking back to his mother, even if he usually obeyed her wishes in the end.

It's not about wanting him to hit on Penny every episode or crack some corny sex-jokes every other line; it's about the fact that he was a spirited, energetic, fun character, and the sparkle has gone out of him. I don't want to watch some hapless loser who is bullied by every person he meets, even if the acting is technically good. Dare I say, even George Constanza had more fight in him than this.

My disappointment and sense of loss are every bit as real and painful as that of the Sheldon Purists. I'm not just sad because there's no more tattoo sleeves or whatever. I thought people already understood that.

ETA again: I don't care if the writing or the acting are technically good, this is not the character I fell in love with, and I do not enjoy watching characters get yelled-at and humiliated.

If B. was presented as sort of a villain/antagonist character like Ramona or Priya, that might make a smidgen more sense, but no. We are told this is a loving relationship, he's lucky to have her, she's the best thing that ever happened to him, and without her he'd be not only lonely and pathetic, but also a despicable sexual deviant.

[Louise]

My reaction to that picture, and the H/B in general:

[Idle Miscreant]

My disappointment and sense of loss are every bit as real and painful as that of the Sheldon Purists. I'm not just sad because there's no more tattoo sleeves or whatever. I thought people already understood that.

This is of course completely understood dear fellow! I'm troubled you have to question that. It is an identical scenario to that of Sheldon's alteration. It's just less blatant to those who don't study the character of Howard as intently, which is why your comments are on the topic are so invaluable and illuminating. We're seeing the same situation repeated in a separate character.

We even get the same idiotic assumption-making criticisms.
You get;
"You just want Howard to go back to being creepy and pathetic and lonely."
Purists get;
"You just want Sheldon to go back to being a mean selfish arsehole."

All those WILDLY presumptuous comments reveal are what those particular people think of the characters. And anyone who thinks Vintage Sheldon is a "mean, selfish arsehole" is not someone whose opinion I'd give a flying fornication over.
Every Sheldon fan I've met dislikes the new Sheldon precisely because he's BECOME a mean, selfish arsehole.
Vintage Sheldon was a whimsical delight.

Don't let them bother you mate.

[Louise]

Thank you, Gripe. I appreciate it

[Berliner]

Bernadette doesn't bother me particularly, other than as an example of the the concept; One must abandon one's hobbies and passions as one gets older. And that being a "grownup" means you can't have light-sabers mounted on the wall. (Why the fuck not?)
[...]
Until this happens (which it won't) I still can't bear to watch the new seasons. Which is a pity, because there's good writing outside the relationship nonsense, excellent acting from Helberg, Sussman etc and this picture looks vaguely like Vintage Sheldon, and I miss the bastard.

This post needs be read by everyone joining / visiting SHQ. Oh how I miss the old days ...

All those WILDLY presumptuous comments reveal are what those particular people think of the characters. And anyone who thinks Vintage Sheldon is a "mean, selfish arsehole" is not someone whose opinion I'd give a flying fornication over.
Every Sheldon fan I've met dislikes the new Sheldon precisely because he's BECOME a mean, selfish arsehole.
Vintage Sheldon was a whimsical delight.

Few people understand Vintage Sheldon. And those who do, can be found here. SHQ is like the "last resistance".