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+---- Thread: The rest of Season Grate (Eps 8.07-8.15 and 8.17) (/showthread.php?tid=251)
RE: The rest of Season Grate - MilleniumRing - 02-20-2015
Okay, so my dad and I had nothing to watch on telly when it got to 8pm. E4 was just sort of 'put on' out of inevitability. Lo and behold, UKs newest episode aired: s8e3. Yes, we're behind. I'm aware. I hated the general episode and my god I can see what you guys mean about the characters being totally alien. I've only read things and seen screencaps or the odd trailer, but to actually sit through 22 minutes of poor writing/directing/acting made me ill. The only highlight to this atrocious episode was the rather endearing moment that Howard announced - proudly - that he'd be throwing a pitch for NASA at a baseball game. His scenes, and Raj's of course, made up the better parts of this episode. I know I can't throw a ball any distance to save my life, so I totally empathised with Howard in this one. Bernadette was a little grating with her comments. She could have been more supportive at the beginning, but she was kind of harsh really.
The other half to the episode felt like a completely different reality. I couldn't even recognise PENNY in the scenes. It was all so stale and yes, Amy is definitely stealing the show from the main characters. She's like a horrid growth that you can't remove because it could be terminal (i.e. the other fans would kill the creators), yet you know that if you keep it around anymore it'll suck out the life from the thing it's attached to. Personally, I'd hack the eyesore off and never look back, but they creators don't dare for fear of upsetting mainstream people.
RE: The rest of Season Grate - wellplayedpenny - 02-20-2015
You know, I spent my time defending Amy Farrah Fowler. I liked s4 'friend' Amy. I liked the humour and dynamic with Sheldon as at that point you could see hints whether it was through Counterfactuals or meme theory that they got along in a way that Sheldon hadn't experienced with another person.
Then came the coital brain transplant where Amy became obsessed with bedding her 'sexy toddler', tricking him into bathing his 'sick' girlfriend (Sheldon spanked her for lying but I believe he was wrong given that she had to be mentally ill to come up with something this twisted) and going through the bizarre act of scenting his office belongings with her tongue and arm pit. There was also a statement by Leonard that Amy watched Sheldon sleeping (didn't Edward watch Bella sleep? And we know what a stable, grounded relationship THAT was. Oh wait, they 'love' each other. Well, I guess the similar logic with the Shamy answers the question of what Stephanie Meyer is writing now).
As I have brought this up several times in conversation, posts and fan fiction, it should be no surprise that Amy's first major strike with me was calling Sheldon's comic book collecting 'lame-o'. To say such a thing, to not recognize the escape the world of Krypton or Gotham city offered a child prodigy who dealt with an imploding home life and people that were 'dumber than a bag of rocks' and he 'scared the bejesus' out of. Comic books gave the man who dealt with the very mysteries of the universe a place for his imagination to run wild. A place where the Other reigns supreme. And didn't get wedgies and swirlies.
Amy's second major strike occurred when she acted like an absolute bitch to Wil Wheaton and then freaked out on Sheldon for not defending her when Wil called her out for being bitchy. To teach Sheldon that a boyfriend 'must defend his girlfriend regardless of how she treats his friends' was beyond atrocious. It was the first time I actually yelled at my television outside of watching a sporting event. Something which BBT is the opposite of unless one counts 'kick the physicist into submission' as an Olympic event.
Which now leads me into tonight's episode. Kripke, Sheldon's rival (as Leslie Winkle is his arch nemesis), comes in to thank Amy for helping him make groundbreaking strides in String Theory. Sheldon is absolutely stunned at the revelation, not so much that Amy actually came up with the idea (so apparently, for those not keeping score, that makes an experimental physicist and a neurobiologist capable of coming up with paradigm-altering PHYSICS ideas. What a sucker Sheldon was for completing his doctorate and post-doctoral focus on theoretical physics. Why, it's like getting a degree in gum-chewing—almost anyone can do it without much effort) but that she actually helped out Kripke. Kripke, who constantly picks on Sheldon, has openly said that he isn't Sheldon's friend and pulled that awful live radio 'prank'. So what was Amy's response to Sheldon being angry about this? "I helped out a fellow colleague. You're being petty."
And that, was major strike three.
Because helping Kripke is a big deal. Kripke made Sheldon doubt himself when he read Kripke's paper. He made Sheldon cry. Amy knew this. She consoled a despondent Sheldon. Even hugged him. And she then turns around and further advances the career of the one man who singlehandedly brought down her 'beloved's' self-esteem and his dream of a Nobel Prize. She knew Sheldon was afraid that he wasn't the 'deal'. And plainly rode over his feelings.
Sheldon is naturally pissed off. Amy said that she went to Kripke because Sheldon wouldn't be receptive to her idea but it's Sheldon's gut that tells him that "she went behind my back to prove me wrong." Amy had already brought in the idea in an earlier episode that Sheldon should accept that all he might do is provide solid research rather than anything groundbreaking. Rather than help bolster him up, she seems determined to take Superman out of the sky, put him in a grey suit and live out his remaining years as Clark Kent.
Then came the moment of clarity for Sheldon, when Penny said that he should take Amy's betrayal and "Let it go." "All my life I've been told that," he replied. "Like my emotions don't matter." And yet isn't this basically been the mantra of Amy ever since they started dating? Oh, wait, I forgot, those were moments of 'humanization'. As TPTB said, Amy constantly pushes Sheldon and eventually he gives in. He accepts. He 'grows'. Because Sheldon is too wound up. Let the bat-crap crazy go. That's what the more vocal Shamys want. Relent. Give in to Amy's reimagining of Sheldon Lee Cooper as they transform from a 'relationship of the mind' to 'coitus is coming'. For the sake of 'humour', Sheldon's complaints and objections have been pushed aside regarding his social obligations to his girlfriend and give her the respect she deserves for being the "best girlfriend [he's] ever going to have". The only thing is that her collaboration with Kripke betrayed their most sacred bond, that of the mind.
Amy says she loves Sheldon. This might be true.
But she doesn't respect him.
Amy then goes on to endear herself with Penny by conducting experiments on her 'Bestie' to test Penny's intelligence against the chimpanzees in her lab. Penny's naturally pissed off (notice the theme this episode?) and demands an apology from Amy for taking her "dignity". Amy figures "about 10 bucks" should cover that. It's been a common occurrence over the past two seasons to have Bernadette and Amy really put down Penny's intelligence. Penny is a normal person not Forrest Gump. She rebuilt a tractor when she was 12 and beat the pants off of Leonard at chess. But Amy has to be elevated above her beautiful friend—after all this is now the Amy Farrah Fowler Show. It's why when Penny comes out with her heartfelt story about Mrs. Wolowitz trying to feed her because she was too skinny was "taken away from her" by Amy saying Mrs. Wolowitz said the same thing to her (because as we all know, if you dressed Penny up in polyester and wool she'd be Amy's identical twin from the back).
So, what can I make of all this? First, Amy gets a 'get out of jail free' card by TPTB even though she's selfish and hypocritical. They know they're doing this too as was seen when Penny accuses Sheldon and Amy of being "so smart they don't care if they hurt other people's feelings". Sheldon agrees completely with the statement while Amy firmly disagrees. Sheldon might have his problems with social protocol but at least he isn't a liar.
Amy has always been the character without a clear personality. She fills in any role the writers want without thought of maintaining any sort of character conformity. Need a theoretical physicist? She's your gal. Want lessons on social etiquette? You know who to call.
Amy's Wonder Woman. Super Girl. She can do anything.
Maybe that's why she doesn't want Sheldon reading comic books.
They might one day give Sheldon supervillain ideas about how to get rid of her.
The last part of the episode dealt with the death of Mrs. Wolowitz. There's really not much to say about it apart from wondering if working in a real death into a sitcom is really such a good idea. When Howard said his mum had died the entire studio was silent because of course the reference was less about Mrs. Wolowitz than Carol Ann Susi. I suppose there are those who like an acknowledgment of real life in their shows. The show, however, could have got along just fine without doing so. As TPTB often say, the episodes aren't linked. They're self-contained and things that happen are quickly forgotten. Not that we'd forget about Howard's mum but she could have just as easily gone to Florida with her dentist lover. I mean we've lost track of Leslie Winkle and she works at the university! Nevertheless, it wasn't (thankfully) over the top. It just wasn't funny. Which I believe is the point of sitcoms.
RE: The rest of Season Grate - devilbk - 02-20-2015
This isn't the first time real death has intruded on a sitcom. It happened on Cheers when Nicholas Colosanto who played Coach died at the end of the third season. I'm sure that I'll think of other examples. But still, it is rare for a sitcom to let the character die along with the person who played them. TBH, I think it's a sign of respect. Having her death provide story fodder for three episodes is a bit much though.
RE: The rest of Season Grate - Louise - 02-20-2015
Sincere question, not rhetorical or sarcastic: what message are TPTB trying to convey, with all this? It seems like they're trying desperately, aggressively hard to promote some agenda or dogma of their own (and squashing dissenting viewpoints), but what is the message?
Because really, all this drama and hostility on a supposed comedy sounds depressing. Sure, bickering couples and wacky misunderstandings and miscommunication have always been a staple of sitcoms, but what's with all this back-stabbing, gossiping, betrayal, resentment, etc?
The message seems to be "don't expect anything from life, just accept any abuse or disappointment that befalls you." For a while, it seemed like the message was "marrying/finding a romantic partner is more important than anything else", and while that's a viewpoint I strongly disagree with, it's at least consistent. But now? What is Sheldon supposed to be learning, from this? If Amy is better than him in every way and she's his teacher and she's going to improve him and fashion him into a better person, then why does she behave so badly? If the couples are so lovely and healthy and romantic and fabulous, why are they portrayed in such a negative way?
Given what was said about TAAHM, today, it almost sounds like TPTB are just blatantly jerking the audience around, now, and at the end, they'll say "Bazinga! These couples you shipped are terrible."
I can't make any sense of this at all, and that's just from reading third-hand information. What is the POINT? (besides money, I mean.) "Some people are just inherently better than others, so you should accept abuse from your betters and never complain?" What's up with that? What is Lorre hoping to accomplish? (again, besides money/power.)
I can't think of *any* demographic of people who would enjoy watching what WPP described above. It's not funny, it's not romantic, it's not sexy, it's not sweet. How is this the #1 show in America when the theme seems to be "Watch an unnattractive woman behave like a sociopath?" (and it's not even played for irony or dark comedy, as far as I can tell.) Is there any precedent for a show like this?
Lorre seems to be trying so*damn*hard* to shove a message down our throats, but the message is unfathomable, and his motivations are equally unfathomable.
I've never heard of another TV show so hell-bent on telling the audience what to think, and actively interfering with the fandom and provoking certain segments of the fanbase. How is it any skin off Lorre's nose if a handful of Shennies still exist? Will their fanfic stop his cashflow? Of course not. I would've thought that most showrunners would laugh-off such things as fandom and fanfiction, and consider it cute and maybe even flattering, but irrelevant.
But now, what they're telling the audience to think, isn't even clear. If everyone's "learning and growing", then why are they so angry and miserable and behaving so unethically?
A soap opera can be fun because it's juicy and scandalous and OTT; this just sounds dreary.
Thought experiment: if you gathered some people who had never seen or heard of the show, and gave them summaries of the last few episodes, how many would want to watch it? I can't imagine that men, women, teenagers, geeks, non-geeks, or people from *any* walk of life would be keen to watch "and then the ugly woman goes around stirring up shit and picking fights and literally nothing else happens." Can you imagine? For that matter, what TV executive would give the go-ahead to a new show of that description?
Can you imagine? "Boy, have I got a splashy new show for you: limp-haired middle-aged woman trudges around whining?" Is that what the American public wants? She's not even being portrayed as deliciously evil and scheming like Joan Crawford or something and she's not a hard-working blue-collar "everywoman" like Roseanne.
Are people *really* tuning-in to this show because they have fond memories of dancing cornstarch from nearly a decade ago? Really? How does that work?
Am I overstating things?
RE: The rest of Season Grate - Trust No One - 02-20-2015
(02-20-2015, 02:10 PM)devilbk Wrote: This isn't the first time real death has intruded on a sitcom. It happened on Cheers when Nicholas Colosanto who played Coach died at the end of the third season. I'm sure that I'll think of other examples. But still, it is rare for a sitcom to let the character die along with the person who played them. TBH, I think it's a sign of respect. Having her death provide story fodder for three episodes is a bit much though.
I agree dev. i thought Cheers handled things very well. Three episodes is way to much.
RE: The rest of Season Grate - FlyingMonkey - 02-20-2015
(02-20-2015, 06:02 PM)Louise Wrote: I can't think of *any* demographic of people who would enjoy watching what WPP described above. It's not funny, it's not romantic, it's not sexy, it's not sweet. How is this the #1 show in America when the theme seems to be "Watch an unnattractive woman behave like a sociopath?" (and it's not even played for irony or dark comedy, as far as I can tell.)
Agreed. But there IS a very small, very vocal group of people who identify so strongly with Amy that they feel that any tactics necessary to get what they feel they "deserve" are justified. They somehow filter out the incredible creepiness and have created a totally different Amy than what everyone else sees.
Yes, it still tops the ratings but I think most viewers now just watch the show out of habit.
RE: The rest of Season Grate - Tuesday Pajamas - 02-21-2015
AMAZING post WWP *cheers*
Sadly, the show seems to resonate with those who have a chip on their shoulder and I think this is why none of us here can relate to it anymore. We don't defy ourselves by Big Bang and don't feel the need to live out our issues through the characters. I simply loved the show because it was clever and funny. Penny's feisty standoff with Sheldon and how she was the only one who could best him, just made me happy. It had nothing to do with my life. And Sheldon being immune to her charms, made him the perfect candidate to show her that looks weren't all she had. Amy's caring towards Sheldon is conditional. What she really wants is to control and alter him to her liking. And Leonard is stuck in high school, wanting a trophy to impress his friends.
RE: The rest of Season Grate - spuffyfan - 02-21-2015
(02-21-2015, 04:22 AM)Tuesday Pajamas Wrote: AMAZING post WWP *cheers*
Sadly, the show seems to resonate with those who have a chip on their shoulder and I think this is why none of us here can relate to it anymore. We don't defy ourselves by Big Bang and don't feel the need to live out our issues through the characters. I simply loved the show because it was clever and funny. Penny's feisty standoff with Sheldon and how she was the only one who could best him, just made me happy. It had nothing to do with my life. And Sheldon being immune to her charms, made him the perfect candidate to show her that looks weren't all she had. Amy doesn't have the warmth. She's a cold fish with too many grudges and agendas. And Leonard is still stuck in high school, wanting a trophy to impress his friends.
Agreed! I watched the show for the comic relief and I also loved the dynamic between Sheldon and Penny. I don't understand why it had to get so personal i.e. catering to people who want to live vicariously through the characters to compensate for all the issues in their own lives. If you ask any Shamy fan why Amy and Sheldon make sense, other than the standard they have a relationship of the mind (utter bull), they would probably list all the terrible things that has happened to Amy in the past (for all we know she made those things up) and how she deserves to be happy. And I ask, why the hell is that Sheldon's problem? Amy had a life before Sheldon and its not impossible to imagine that she would have a life after Sheldon. The two characters' lives are not inextricably tied by a common destiny (let's just ignore the nonsense that was parroted by the psychic last season - Sheldon didn't need Amy to excel in Science as a child prodigy, when he got the job at Caltech, etc. so I refuse to believe that she is the key to his success - no way hozay!). As far as I am concerned, the ingredients of a good relationship are love (or at the very least you should like the person you're with), compassion/understanding, respect and - maybe I'm being old-fashioned - happiness. Based on what you guys say about Amy - I don't usually watch non-Shenny scenes these days - most times she is either exasperated or angry, and barely tolerates Sheldon and his idiosyncrasies. So I ask, why the hell are they together apart from the fact that the entire Shamy relationship is based on a wish-fulfilment fantasy? Not surprising since these are the very same people who produced Lenny. My mistake really - I had high hopes!
RE: The rest of Season Grate - Nutz - 02-21-2015
(01-19-2015, 08:33 PM)Tuesday Pajamas Wrote: I like these promo gifs..
Left out B and A. Theirs were a bit naff.
![[Image: tumblr_nbnru1oTWe1qdz44io1_250.gif]](https://38.media.tumblr.com/67e90e03d35957cb8c4c579b40c17d1a/tumblr_nbnru1oTWe1qdz44io1_250.gif)
![[Image: tumblr_nbnru1oTWe1qdz44io2_250.gif]](https://38.media.tumblr.com/12c6609d8dac3f8a7a11d984065fe62d/tumblr_nbnru1oTWe1qdz44io2_250.gif)
![[Image: tumblr_nbnru1oTWe1qdz44io3_250.gif]](https://33.media.tumblr.com/2871e559ec7a8fd3a45ab9d5dbfdeab5/tumblr_nbnru1oTWe1qdz44io3_250.gif)
![[Image: tumblr_nbnru1oTWe1qdz44io4_250.gif]](https://38.media.tumblr.com/ef65ab60136ff4fffa5f024d3fddf2c3/tumblr_nbnru1oTWe1qdz44io4_250.gif)
![[Image: tumblr_nbnru1oTWe1qdz44io7_250.gif]](https://33.media.tumblr.com/4940d408214d167d8335c4f6168e3821/tumblr_nbnru1oTWe1qdz44io7_250.gif)
![[Image: tumblr_nbnru1oTWe1qdz44io8_250.gif]](https://38.media.tumblr.com/2724c4d3dfc250a5f6d3ba0761f49818/tumblr_nbnru1oTWe1qdz44io8_250.gif)
![[Image: tumblr_nbnru1oTWe1qdz44io9_250.gif]](https://33.media.tumblr.com/03ba76ec561f5df7b0b1f7cd2d7b4c1b/tumblr_nbnru1oTWe1qdz44io9_250.gif)
![[Image: tumblr_nbnru1oTWe1qdz44io10_250.gif]](https://33.media.tumblr.com/2e0090d6ffe5929889516c18a9a320f0/tumblr_nbnru1oTWe1qdz44io10_250.gif)
It's a Party, We're having fun, We're Dancing, and then............... Leonard scares the hell out of you. Seems accurate to the show
RE: The rest of Season Grate - Berliner - 02-21-2015
Great post WPP!
And Amy can into string theory?
What's next? Amy doing research with Hawking? NO COMMENT
